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Proof Jesus pre-existed, Jesus is our example or pattern, condemnation, original sin, Jesus fallen nature

Q5: Ch:11. The Baptism

Show the Desire of Ages is inspired..

(1) Jesus was for us an example..

Jesus did not receive baptism as a confession of guilt on His own account. He identified Himself withsinners, taking the steps that we are to take, and doing the work that we must do. His life of sufferingand patient endurance after His baptism was also an example to us.

The Spirit of Prophecy says "example" here because the New Testament translation does, and often we deal with fuzzy translations, so as not to discourage the reader of child like faith. We all have to have child like faith, and we always deal with fuzzy translations, but never once does SOP talk about translations, and accepts the translations in the light they are presented. This does NOT mean the SOP does NOT present Hebrew truth, for SOP does present original Hebrew truth, if the reader goes looking.

How does a reader go looking....?

(1) First I checked the word "example" in the NT verses to see if there was a common number of verses using that word. There wasn't... if there was more than 20 verses, I use a dictionary by Jeff Benner to convert the Greek back to the Hebrew. But if there is only 6 verses, than one must cross reference the NT verses to OT verses...

I use Power BibleCD (software costs $20 online) because it is simple to use, and allows you with one click to look up all the verses on a Greek word. Than I click on each verse for a cross have to do this because translations do NOT translate a Greek word or a Hebrew word with the same English word all the time, because during translation translators like to change the English to different contexts...and this spoils a faithful translation of the Greek or Hebrew.

For example "hupodeigma" Strong's 5262, translated as "Example" is also translated as "Pattern", so which meaning is 5262 ?

In Hebrews 8:5 there is a cross reference to Exodus 25:40, so the word translated "example" should be actually "pattern".

A pattern is an example anyway...a mute point... but it is important to faithfully translate a Hebrew or Greek word the same English word.

Notice SOP makes no comments on "example" here, only presenting the word to the reader.

Does SOP agree "example" should mean the Hebrew word "pattern" in the English? Yes

Notice :-

By believing in Jesus, you are not only to save your own souls, but by precept and example you are to seek to save other souls. Take Christ as your pattern. {AH 96.2}

"Thus saith the Lord." Parents, let Christ's life be the pattern……. Christ came to this world to give them a living example of what they all must be….., {CG 80.3}

How many who have been entrusted with talents of influence and means have lost sight of the Pattern, and follow the standard of the world instead of the example of Christ. {CTr 50.3}

Notice the above examples also assume you have access to EGW WORKS software, where all SOP writings are indexed in Folio Views Software. Than you search "example" and "pattern" and go through all 300+ hits looking for suitable passages for the reader to read.This is also time consuming, but it shows the reader the joy one finds when we find evidence that SOP does indeed always present Hebrew truth, if we go looking for it.

1Pe 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example (pattern), that ye should follow his steps:

Now for a beginner, it is suggested you do things gradually, and get used to the process of reading SOP words carefully and Hebrew words in our Bible. It takes time to learn a strange language, but its worth it. How amazing that SOP tells us so plainly that "example" means "pattern" which is the Hebrew meaning of this word in Scripture !!

So Jesus is our pattern for us to follow...but do we follow the pattern?

(1) Jesus was baptised..

(2) Jesus did redemptive work on Sabbath...he did not cease everything..

(3) Jesus also followed feasts and other object lessons as a pattern for us to follow..

For more help on doing word studies:-

  • How Scriptures should be studied.
  • A child like Scripture Study Method.
  • Criticisms on the child like studies.

    (2) Jesus came in our fallen nature..

    From the open heavens a voice was heard saying, "This is Mybeloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."These words of confirmation were given to inspire faith in those who witnessed the scene, and tostrengthen the Saviour for His mission. Notwithstanding that the sins of a guilty world were laid uponChrist, notwithstanding the humiliation of taking upon Himself our fallen nature, the voice from heavendeclared Him to be the Son of the Eternal.

    When Adam first sinned there came an immediate change to the nature of mankind. The natural changes are not sinful, but one that is fallen. Reading through Romans 5, it is difficult to unravel the verses written by Paul, but one verse speaks clearly about these matters:-

    Ro 5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

  • 17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
  • 18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

  • Ro 8:1 ¶ There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

    This word condemnation is used only 3 times in the New Testament, and is a judical word referring to a judgement decree made in a heavenly court. It is saying when Adam first sinned, condemnation came upon mankind, and there was an immediate change to the ruler of planet earth, from Adam to Satan.

    There were also other immediate changes too, to our natural flesh, which is kept living by a divine relationship of the Father's life force administrated via the Holy Spirit as the "breath of life", this relationship daily died when Adam sinned, and so we live under a fallen nature. Thus we are no longer ruled by GOD and we no longer have the perfect relationship of divine power flowing through our flesh. As a result of these two major changes, Satan rules over mankind making mankind a sinner from birth by natural means of deception, and our DNA which controls our flesh falls into decay, corruption and mistakes, causing us to age, decay and finally lose that vital connection with GOD (we die).

    Many say the salvation covenant in the OT was different to the covenant salvation in the NT. But they are not different but the same.

    Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sin-offerings.

    Why could not animal blood take away confessed sins upon the sin-offering? Such offering were perfect unblemished animals, young in age and a family pet friend, as the torah teachings required such sin-offerings to be. So what was wrong with them ? Animal blood has no internal life force in it, only that coming by faith in the Father's life force do animals have living energy. They cannot generate living energy on their own, because animals are NOT Creators. This is the only reason why the blood(or life force) of animals cannot remove sin-offerings confessed upon them. This also explains why a heavenly angel cannot die for human sin-offerings, because heavenly angels do not have "life force" Creator powers within themselves. This is also why Jesus could NOT be a sinless man born and chosen by the heavenly Father, from the time of Mary's womb, because such a Being called the Son of GOD would NOT have it's own "life force" Creator power within himself, the sinless sacrifice still would be no different to animal sacrifices who are also sinless. Animals do not make cognitive sins, but can at times behave cruelly as programming gone wrong, but such animals are not able to atone for sin-offerings. Animals live by hope daily, in the Father's life force, and a non-pre-existing Jesus would only have life in hope of His Father's life force as well. Such a human sinless Being could not atone for sinners, because the torah-teachings require "life for life", eternal living for "eternal non-existence" (Exodus 21:23,24,25). Therefore Jesus must be pre-existing as the Son of GOD from eternity, with Creator "life force" within Himself, but when Jesus became a man Jesus emptied Himself, and took upon Himself humanity in it's fallen nature, the same way we sinners do from birth, "warts and all".

    While believing saints can by faith and will cling to Jesus, the flesh is weak, and falls often into sinning. Jesus knew this problem as well, and so had to live in our fallen nature to empower our fallen nature so even our flesh is able to stand before GOD...Jesus began the first stages of immortality for our flesh, the Holy Spirit quickens our flesh, and as long as we allow GOD to walk over us, subdue; and take control of our flesh, we will obey perfectly and receive the finishing touches of immortality when Jesus comes the second time towards earth.

    Ro 8:3 For what the torah-teachings could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sin-offering flesh, and for sin-offering, condemned sin-offering in the flesh: (author's translation)

    How well SOP speaks of Jesus taking up our fallen nature, so we can overcome as Jesus overcome, Jesus is our pattern how to walk, how to eat, how to pray and how to help others. We have no excuse for not reaching our heavenly Father, Jesus is our pattern in everything...follow in His steps and do all things as Jesus did. Shalom

    Consider what specifically changed in the fall of Adam, when found missing in the spiritual connection to GOD.

    The relationship with the Holy Spirit was still there, though damage was done, and the covering of the Holy Spirit shrank causing them to be naked, and opening up all manner of physical chaos...

    The man's will was still there, though now there was a change in where the power for the soul came from, from our own Baal-master power of self.

    This is what is really causing the relationship with GOD to be missing...we are selfishly empowering ourselves...abusing God's gifts of love and power in us, thinking we can master ourselves as we see fit...This is what sinning really means, to be missing power from relationship...thus our relationship with GOD is broken and we do things on our own, rather than in relationship...

    Jesus came o n earth, to be a Baal-master power for our soul, in fallen humanity, so that we could be able to live again for eternity in relationship.Only a pre-existing Jesus from eternity could do this...On the earth Jesus walked and talked and empowered himself in His Father's and Holy Spirit's love, in relationship...though he walked in a fallen body of humanity..Not once did Jesus use his own Baal-master powers of divinity, for doing so would cause Him to miss on power via relationship with the Father and the Holy Spirit...

    But once Jesus became the sin-offering for those who believe on Jesus for the entire world, His own Baal-Master divine powers can flow into us, as we hop from our own Baal-master powers of self, to Jesus who is our Baal-Master power of our soul...and so daily and minute by minute we grow in a divine eternal relationship with Jesus...Only a pre-existing Jesus, with divinity powers of being a Master, could achieve this.

    Now salvation flows from the Father, via the Holy Spirit, into the Son Jesus, as a Baal-Master power to anyone who wishes to hop from his own Baal-master power of self, to Jesus as our daily Master of our soul.Question is do you O reader, want this Master daily flow from Jesus, or do you want to be your own master ?

    Salvation is, who mastering you? Yourself or relationship?

    The next chapter of Desire of Ages..we look at the Temptation, how Jesus overcame Satan..

    Desire of Ages theme

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